[leucetios]

Rather than pulled from the headline, here's one pulled from the TV Show Law & Order.

The plot (for those who didn't see the SVU premier).

A woman hires a PI to get her child back. Her child died in a car wreck 4 years prior, but she believes the child lived. She sees a kid one day in the park and fixates on it as hers. Tries to have it kidnapped.

As the show progresses we find out that:

1. her kid is dead
2. this other kid is hers too. Both she and this other woman went to a fertility clinic. The other woman was sterile, so the Doctor (without permission) implanted an extra embryo from Woman 1 into Woman 2.

The questions:

Does Woman1 have an legal claim to this child?

How would you feel, or would you care, knowing that there were biological children of yours in the world you might never know (as in if you did sperm or egg donation)?

[Banana]

I felt weird about that episode. Personally, I didn't think she should have any rights to the living daughter. Biologically, it was hers, but she was not the mother. She did not do the parenting. It was no fault of her own, and in fact, she was exploited, but the child suffers in the end. And I think that's the main reason why she should have no rights to that child.

[leucetios]

so how would you feel knowing you had little unknown bananas running around out there

[Velvet]

I dont think she should be able to take the child but she should be allowed to have some involvement in the childs life ... perhaps as a relative so that she may see her daughtewr grow and be apart of that .

[Banana]

Originally posted by leucetios@Sep 23 2004, 04:26 PM
so how would you feel knowing you had little unknown bananas running around out there

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Maybe I'm heartless.....or maybe it's because I'm not a mother. But, if I had little bananas out there, and didn't know about it for years, and didn't raise them.....*shrug* I may want to meet them, but I wouldn't demand they come into my custody. Now, the only disclaimer is if I knew they were being treated badly. That would change everything.

[leucetios]

And certainly, losing her own daughter made this woman fixate on another biological child she had out there in the world even more.

Its Pet Semetary syndrome, right?

[greg]

Shit, here I go again.


I am an adopted child.

I don't give a shit about who "spit" me out. My adopted parents, are my parents, period. However, knowing my biological parents would be fine with me.

So, in conclusion, No I don't believe a biological parent has the right to demand custody (in any case) over the parents that have loved and raised a child.


Just sayin.


moke:

[leucetios]

what if the biological parents come looking for custody, in a case like the one I outlined, where the child is too young (let's say two or younger) to really have been "raised" by the other parents?

[APB]

I would have to agree with Banana. Why damage the child mentally.

[greg]

Originally posted by leucetios@Sep 23 2004, 04:40 PM
what if the biological parents come looking for custody, in a case like the one I outlined, where the child is too young (let's say two or younger) to really have been "raised" by the other parents?

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So, if I have no idea that I have a child (probably don't even care) and then I lose a child, it gives me the right to "take" someone elses child?

Not buying it.



Just sayin.


moke:

[Velvet]

After the first year biological parents dont have any rights what so ever .

[leucetios]

So where's the line?

What IF:

Someone kidnaps a child when it is 6 weeks old. They "legally" adopt it out and a couple raises it as their own. Now, at 8 years old, or 6 or 12, you find out the kid is the one that was kidnapped from the original parents. Its lived with these people as its parents its whole life.

Do you take it reunite it with the biological parents?

[Velvet]

Thats a hard one as the parents didnt give their child away it was stolen . I think they should be in the childs life but it would have to be done very slowly . If you love your child you want what is best and if the child is in a loving home then I dont think you would want to tear its life to pieces . The child should be told as its it s right to know .

[leucetios]

Originally posted by Velvet@Sep 23 2004, 02:54 PM
The child should be told as its it s right to know .

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This leads to an interesting question. Bill should have some good input here. Let's assume a traditional adoption. When is a "good time" to tell the child it is adopted? Do you always let it be known, so there is no defining moment when you have to say "you are adopted"? On the other hand, if you tell the child from birth (basically) it is adopted are you undermining your relationship with it in some way?

Thoughts?

[Velvet]

I know thew laws in NewZealand on this and a child is told at a very young age that its adopted so that its less traumatic on the child later on . You can tell a child carefully so a child will feel very special and that it is loved very much . I feel handling it this way is a much wiser way of doing it and less hurtful to the child .

[Bill]

I two saw this episode...so where do I start....

I don't know my sperm doner's name, he didn't stay around long enough. (keep the comments to yourself guys). the man who raised me, may he rest in peace, is my dad by all meaning of the word. 5 min. of "fun" don't magically turn you into someones mother or father, nither does doing laundry or cookin diner for that matter.

Now as for the case proposed...The woman should have no rights.....but the doctor should have to provide restitution....maybe in the form of say a collage fund in the decessed girls name, and specifically designed for the living child. The biological Mother is nothing more then that....

Hell I know I'm not the only one here that's "donated" a fair amount of baby batter to verious scores (and we ain't talkin sperm banks either) and if there's a billy or billie runnin around out there somewhere. so be it. I wasn't involved before I knew, so why try to force myself where I wasn't wanted? those who know me know how much my younguns meen to me, and that'd I'd do anything for um. so it's not that I'm a heartless bastard. Its just the way I see things.

[Bill]

as an afternote....Leu...the child should be told...when? every child is different...I didn't find out till my 22nd bd.....hell of a presant...let me tell ya. Would I have minded telling everyone my "father" was a piece of shit...na probly not ...but I do remember having a friend that was adopted, and it was hard for hime to admit it. you'll know when the child is ready.

nother story...I know a guy, lets call him joe. joe was 18 and drafted for nam right outta school. leaves behind a sweetheart, he dosn't know she's pregnant, several years later, he comes home, she's marrie d to some other dude, and has popped out a few more. he moves on and starts a family of his own...20 plus years later, he gets a call from this kid sayin he's his son...they end up getting together and cann't stand each other...kid grew up in south philly, Joe was just a country boy from florida. they met once and that was it...havn't seen or spoke to each other since.

it just goes to show knowin or not knowin doesn't make one iotta difference, because your always gonna fall back on what is familier to you, and in these cases, the serigate, or adopted family.

[Kyan]

Call me old-fashioned, but I like my conditioners to be conditioners and my shampoos to be shampoos.



Oh I'm sorry, What were we talking about again?

[leucetios]

Originally posted by Wyldbill@Sep 23 2004, 05:51 PM
it just goes to show knowin or not knowin doesn't make one iotta difference, because your always gonna fall back on what is familier to you, and in these cases, the serigate, or adopted family.

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I hear ya. I have a friend whose mom never married his dad, and his dad just bailed. Was never, ever around. His mom is the sweetest person I know, and she has never said anything bad about this man, I think she may have preferred being alone. Anyway, when my friend was in his early 20s this guy comes back and wants to have dinner with them. My friend was like, "why? I don't know you. I don't feel like I need you in my life, my mom's been enough parent. I should have dinner so you can feel better??"

He didn't bother. This man was not his father, except biologically, and sometimes when you get right down to it that doesn't count for much.

If I adopted a kid (which, if I ever have kids is probably the way I will do it) I think I will try to make it so they know they are adopted the whole time, without pushing it in their face, and while still making it known I love them. The idea being to avoid that one big moment that can define, or redefine, the childs (and your) life.

Adopting a kid of a different race makes this easier

[asshat]

Wow, this is a tough one. I have vacillated in every direction thinking about what would be the right thing to do. I think that woman1 should continue to stalk the child, occasionally send some kind of a creepy letter made from words clipped from magazines that say things like "you are not who you think you are". Then, when the child and his family are at the point of calling the cops woman1 should volunteer her services to the family as a gypsy fortune teller and invite the child and woman2 to a seance where she could inform them that the child has another mother and woman2 is a fake.

I haven't really thought of an ending yet. As I said, this is a hard question and crosses many moral lines.