[Flumper Barflusterbutt]

Problem now is............what is Plan B?

[BIRD33]

Well, no doubt all of the windfall bonuses and big compensation packages have to be taken out of it, that was a no brainer. If the democrats are the one that forced that issue, then power to them.

I think it boiled down to the constituents. I heard last night, several congressmen from texas that voted against it, and they were saying that their emails from constituents was running like 80 or 90% against it.

How could they vote for something when the people they represent are not for it?

I think people hear the words "Wall Street Bailout" and automatically think why should I have to bail those fat cats out?I don't think they (or I ) fully comprehend how bad it could be if we let all those banks go bankrupt.If you need lines of credit to run your small business you'd probably be fucked.

[Flumper Barflusterbutt]

I have heard its already beginning to hit. I heard that credit card limits have started to be lowered. What a brilliant concept.

To be honest, I think all this credit bullshit needs to be tightened up. The idea that a person can finance a house with 0 down is ridiculous. And have you ever had a realtor calculate how much of a house loan you can qualify for? Its crazy.

[BIRD33]

http://www.marginalrevolution.com/margin...nd-wo.html


[B]The best and worst case scenarios

The best case scenario: The bad banks continue to be bought up, there is no run on hedge funds next Tuesday, only mid-sized European banks fail, money market funds keep on buying commercial paper, and the Fed and Treasury continue to operate on a case-by-case basis. Since Congress doesn't have to vote for something called "a bailout," it can give Paulson and Bernanke more operational freedom than they would have otherwise had. The American economy is in recession for two years and unemployment does not rise above eight or nine percent.

The worst case scenario: Credit markets freeze up within the next week and many businesses cannot meet their payrolls. Margin calls cannot be met and the NYSE shuts down for a week. Hardly anyone can get a mortgage so most home prices end up undefined rather than low. There is an emergency de facto nationalization of banks to keep the payments system moving. The Paulson plan is seen as a lost paradise. There is no one to buy up the busted hedge funds, so government and the taxpayer end up holding the bag. The quasi-nationalized banks are asked to serve political ends and it proves hard to recapitalize them in private hands. In the very worst case scenario, the Chinese bubble bursts too.

I still think some version of the best case scenario is more plausible, but I wish I could tell you I am sure.
[/B]

[Bill]

Besides the fact that it's a direct turn to socialism, which we know doesn't work, (history tells us so) This whole thing is $700 billion that the nation does not have and cannot afford. The money will go to bail out banks that were run into the dirt by greedy idiots. It's bad for the dollar. For the last 15 years, the U.S. money supply has grown about twice as fast as GDP. Federal government liabilities, meanwhile, have grown three times as fast. It now has more financial obligations than assets. It is, effectively, broke. All this new government borrowing will create so much new money that it will destroy the dollar's buying power. Now you're talking complete collapse or a possible move to the theorized Amero. (hey it's working great for europe). If it doesn't get passed, yeah things will get bad, but it's still just a market correction which is what we're essentially going through right now. So yeah, I'm in the fuck the banks, we'll grin and bear it camp.

[Flumper Barflusterbutt]

Besides the fact that it's a direct turn to socialism, which we know doesn't work, (history tells us so) This whole thing is $700 billion that the nation does not have and cannot afford. The money will go to bail out banks that were run into the dirt by greedy idiots. It's bad for the dollar. For the last 15 years, the U.S. money supply has grown about twice as fast as GDP. Federal government liabilities, meanwhile, have grown three times as fast. It now has more financial obligations than assets. It is, effectively, broke. All this new government borrowing will create so much new money that it will destroy the dollar's buying power. Now you're talking complete collapse or a possible move to the theorized Amero. (hey it's working great for europe). If it doesn't get passed, yeah things will get bad, but it's still just a market correction which is what we're essentially going through right now. So yeah, I'm in the fuck the banks, we'll grin and bear it camp.

I think this is pretty much how most of America feels right now. I think that most of the people in America are thinking "what's the worst that can happen. My money is insured up to $100,000 in the bank. I can handle my debt load right now. I didn't cause any of this."

But, if that is the case, how did the lawmakers in Washington get so far off track that they came up with this plan? How can they be so out of tune with the American people?

[B@nana]

Can someone post a link to the countless Canadian socialist health care threads. Up here, we get mad that our diaphragms aren't covered. But then again our gov't isn't trying to sweep $700B (american) under the rug.

'Bode Yankees! :roll:

[Banana]

Huh. Good point. :confused:

[B@nana]

Huh. Good point. :confused:

See the Canadian Looney is currently worth more than the U.S.Dollar........sheesh!

[Vitamin E]

see the canadian looney is currently worth more than the u.s.dollar........sheesh!

fail!

[BIRD33]

I think this is pretty much how most of America feels right now. I think that most of the people in America are thinking "what's the worst that can happen. My money is insured up to $100,000 in the bank. I can handle my debt load right now. I didn't cause any of this."

But, if that is the case, how did the lawmakers in Washington get so far off track that they came up with this plan? How can they be so out of tune with the American people?

Wouldnt not bailing out the banks kill small business?Most of the contractors I deal with have a revolving line of credit they use to buy material and pay their workers.If that credit drys up construction would almost stop completely.

[Flumper Barflusterbutt]

Wouldnt not bailing out the banks kill small business?Most of the contractors I deal with have a revolving line of credit they use to buy material and pay their workers.If that credit drys up construction would almost stop completely.

From what I have read that is the section of people that are going to get killed. The ones that rely on credit to run small companies.

[Anhil8tor]

how bout fuck'em. Let them all fail and go bankrupt. Let the market crash and when I think it hits bottom I'll invest in some stock and enjoy the ride up.

I actually put some money in the market yesterday afternoon...

[Bill]

I think this is pretty much how most of America feels right now. I think that most of the people in America are thinking "what's the worst that can happen. My money is insured up to $100,000 in the bank. I can handle my debt load right now. I didn't cause any of this."

But, if that is the case, how did the lawmakers in Washington get so far off track that they came up with this plan? How can they be so out of tune with the American people?

Well that all boils down to strait up opinion. My opinion is that washington is so caught up in things like the approval rating of the war, hunting terrorists, healthcare/insurance, run away energy prices, and the biggest of them all party politics, that they've lost touch with the people that put them in office. the perfect example of this was yesterday's vote. It got knocked down simply because there were a dosen or so hold outs who still listen to their constituates. (people who were lobbied to vote yes, but still voted no due to the outcry of the voters back home) One of the biggest proplems facing this country is party polotics...we have simply outgrown the two party system. it's too bloated as it is and what we need is a new, widely accepted 3rd party to put everyone back on their toes.

[Bill]

From what I have read that is the section of people that are going to get killed. The ones that rely on credit to run small companies.

but in all honesty is that the proper way to run a small company? yeah it's now considered acceptable practice but that dosn't make it right. 30 years ago alot less people were starting their own businesses simply because they didn't have the start-up capitol. now everyone can do it, just borrow the money.

[Flumper Barflusterbutt]

but in all honesty is that the proper way to run a small company? yeah it's now considered acceptable practice but that dosn't make it right. 30 years ago alot less people were starting their own businesses simply because they didn't have the start-up capitol. now everyone can do it, just borrow the money.

I agree. I think that all of this easy credit shit should be done away with. I have always been a big advocate that you don't buy a house until you can put 20% down and get a 30 year fixed rate mortage. You don't use credit cards unless you keep them paid off month to month. You don't buy a car unless you can get (and afford) a 36 or 48 month loan. You don't take out home equity loans unless it is an absolute emergency. You don't buy warranties on every electronic device or appliance that you buy.

All of these things that people have been tricked into doing these past few years is bullshit and it has finally caught up with everyone.

[snarg]

someone get snarg outta bed so he can tell us how it all went down during the great depression or the stock market crash...

there was a lot of defenestration going on






look that up in yer funk and wagnalls

[Anhil8tor]

The term was coined around the time of an incident in Prague Castle in the year of 1618.

s'all I needed to know

[Flumper Barflusterbutt]

there was a lot of defenestration going on






look that up in yer funk and wagnalls

Defenestration is like a banning.

[Bill]

I agree. I think that all of this easy credit shit should be done away with. I have always been a big advocate that you don't buy a house until you can put 20% down and get a 30 year fixed rate mortage. You don't use credit cards unless you keep them paid off month to month. You don't buy a car unless you can get (and afford) a 36 or 48 month loan. You don't take out home equity loans unless it is an absolute emergency. You don't buy warranties on every electronic device or appliance that you buy.

All of these things that people have been tricked into doing these past few years is bullshit and it has finally caught up with everyone.

Exactly but don't forget the group of people that get pissed off at their boss and say fuck you I can do it better.