Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - Printable Version
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Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - leucetios - 10-18-2005
cannonman Wrote:Judeo/ Christian does not necessarily mean pedophilia but moving a Cardinal away from it and not punishing him for it does show that they condone it now. This goes all the way to the Pope and, if this were a corporation vs. a religion doing it, it would not have been let go like this.
Pedophile priests have been around for a long time. The church knows and has known this all along. How did they punish the priests? They moved them to unsuspecting parishes.
That is fine, but you're also missing the point. The judeo/christian values do not condone pedophilia. There is a vast difference between the teachings and the morals of a religion, and the people in charge of that religion. The Pope could turn out to be jew hating nazi and start WWIII and be the next Hitler. Doesn't mean the bible condones that.
The teachings are seperate from the people enforcing them.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - suzy - 10-18-2005
leucetios Wrote:Neither of your two comments in there address:
- pedophilia and why you would think the judeo-christian value set condones, or encourage it.
- why, if people followed (not just pretended to follow) those morals they would be hyprocrite. The judeo christian morals do not say things like "lie, but tell other people not to" If they did, they would be hypocritical. They don't.
Come up with some decent arguments, and something worth posting.
Okay, so I used bad examples, when I have more time I will put down what I was trying to put across, I gotta run again kids home
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - cannonman - 10-18-2005
leucetios Wrote:That is fine, but you're also missing the point. The judeo/christian values do not condone pedophilia. There is a vast difference between the teachings and the morals of a religion, and the people in charge of that religion. The Pope could turn out to be jew hating nazi and start WWIII and be the next Hitler. Doesn't mean the bible condones that.
The teachings are seperate from the people enforcing them.
It does condone slavery and women as possession still. My point is you have to pick and choose your morals, even from the bible. Like it or not, the people who run the faith are the faith.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - Beaucephus - 10-18-2005
cannonman Wrote:Morality is based on how you want to be treated and projecting that onto the people you come into contact with. The ten commandments are outdated and still favor slavery and women being less than equal as possessions.
The first commandments are based on you having Christianity as a faith. This to me makes you no more or less moral.
Interesting topic, BTW. Thanks
Nowhere in the ten commandments themselves does it condone slavery or the oppression of women. No offense, but to say that directives such as "thou shalt not steal" are outdated is simply ludicrous.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - leucetios - 10-18-2005
cannonman Wrote:It does condone slavery and women as possession still. My point is you have to pick and choose your morals, even from the bible. Like it or not, the people who run the faith are the faith.
I half agree with you. You do need to pick and chose your morals, to some degree, from whatever value set you get them from.
However, the people who run the faith, are not the faith. The faith is soemthing different, which stands on its own. The people who run the faith abusing its power is why you get different sects spinning off trying to put the religion back on what they see as the track. I can appreciate much of the bible's morals and lessons, but I will never step foot in a church again in my life (funerals and weddings notwithstanding). A large part of my reason for that is that I don't think the people representing the faith have a good handle on the faith.
An even larger part of it is that I am an atheist.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - cannonman - 10-18-2005
Beaucephus Wrote:Nowhere in the ten commandments themselves does it condone slavery or the oppression of women. No offense, but to say that directives such as "thou shalt not steal" are outdated is simply ludicrous.
You shall not covet your neighbor's house..." (in Exodus, the text reads "... neighbour's house, ... neighbour's wife, nor his manservant..."
This is generally accepted to mean slave.
Sometimes omissions mean more than what is in writing. Notice it mentions neighbor's wife. Doesn't this hint at her a possession in the context of everything else?
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - Bill - 10-18-2005
So when is somebody gonna get nekkid?
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - leucetios - 10-18-2005
Bill Wrote:So when is somebody gonna get nekkid?
Probably right when you leave,
sin,
Mrs Bill
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - Bill - 10-18-2005
leucetios Wrote:Probably right when you leave,
sin,
Mrs Bill
always hating on the married folks......
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - leucetios - 10-18-2005
Bill Wrote:always hating on the married folks......
It is my new thing.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - Bill - 10-18-2005
leucetios Wrote:It is my new thing.
it's ok...I know you want me.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - leucetios - 10-18-2005
Bill Wrote:it's ok...I know you want me.
Are you sure you didn't mean "no"?
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - Bill - 10-18-2005
leucetios Wrote:Are you sure you didn't mean "no"?
pretty sure.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - greg - 10-19-2005
Aren't morals instilled by people in your life? (I.E. Parents, teachers, priests, etc.)
I don't totally agree with the religeous tact that this thread has taken.
However, morals vary greatly between people (I.E. My parents are Mormon they don't drink or smoke, yet I do. I still couldn't hurt someone, just because, do to their teachings)
Make any sense?
(thanks Leo, I love these kinds of threads)
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - leucetios - 10-19-2005
greg Wrote:Aren't morals instilled by people in your life? (I.E. Parents, teachers, priests, etc.)
I don't totally agree with the religeous tact that this thread has taken.
However, morals vary greatly between people (I.E. My parents are Mormon they don't drink or smoke, yet I do. I still couldn't hurt someone, just because, do to their teachings)
Make any sense?
(thanks Leo, I love these kinds of threads)
This thread I think took a religous tact because a lot of people's morals are culled from their religion, then there was also Suzy crazy talk.
Morals are instilled by parents, teachers, etc. Extrapolate it one level up and morals are, for the most part, instilled by the society you live in. For example: most of us consider it 'wrong' to have sex with a sibling, however it might be acceptable in certain subcultures (sup Alabama?).
So to address the second part of my original question, what determines is a person has no morals? Well, I think, that outside of sociopaths, everyone has morals. Morals define what is right and wrong, and while you might not share the same morals as your neighbor, spouse, or country, everyone probably has some built in idea of what is wrong and right for them.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - Banana - 10-19-2005
leucetios Wrote:This thread I think took a religous tact because a lot of people's morals are culled from their religion, then there was also Suzy crazy talk.Why don;t you think sociopaths have morals?
Morals are instilled by parents, teachers, etc. Extrapolate it one level up and morals are, for the most part, instilled by the society you live in. For example: most of us consider it 'wrong' to have sex with a sibling, however it might be acceptable in certain subcultures (sup Alabama?).
So to address the second part of my original question, what determines is a person has no morals? Well, I think, that outside of sociopaths, everyone has morals. Morals define what is right and wrong, and while you might not share the same morals as your neighbor, spouse, or country, everyone probably has some built in idea of what is wrong and right for them.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - leucetios - 10-19-2005
Banana Wrote:Why don;t you think sociopaths have morals?
I am no psychologist, but I was under the impression that one of the traits of a sociopath was that they had no moral compass. I.e. they might know right from wrong in a legal sense, that they might get in trouble for killing a person, but not in a moral sense. They would think there was nothing "wrong" with it.
I guess it could be viewed as a different moral standard.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - Banana - 10-19-2005
leucetios Wrote:I am no psychologist, but I was under the impression that one of the traits of a sociopath was that they had no moral compass. I.e. they might know right from wrong in a legal sense, that they might get in trouble for killing a person, but not in a moral sense. They would think there was nothing "wrong" with it.Yeah. That is what they think, but your last part is what I was getting at. They have their own morals. Which can be said for any of us and all deviants. Unless we only use legalities as definitions for morals.
I guess it could be viewed as a different moral standard.
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - snarg - 10-19-2005
Banana Wrote:Why don;t you think sociopaths have morals?
by definition
Tough Quesiton of the Day 10/18/2005 - leucetios - 10-19-2005
Banana Wrote:Yeah. That is what they think, but your last part is what I was getting at. They have their own morals. Which can be said for any of us and all deviants.
Point well taken. I stand corrected.
Are you calling me a deviant? :wub: