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big day for MA - WoolyGoat - 01-20-2010
I obviously used some hyperbole in my description.
I agree with a lot of what Kennedy stands for, but too much of it is too far out there to be taken seriously. I think he should (and hope he does) pursue some local/state gov't jobs before taking another crack at washington.
big day for MA - Banana - 01-20-2010
Don't be using such hig brow words!
big day for MA - WoolyGoat - 01-20-2010
you're right, hig brow words are the worst
big day for MA - Banana - 01-20-2010
This is the level of intelligence you are dealing with here.
big day for MA - littlelolly - 01-20-2010
BIRD33 Wrote:does anyone really believe she wouldnt take assistance if the husband couldnt find a job like a million americans right now are having problems doing?Can I get one honest persons opinion here.This smells of someone who depends on someone else to bring in the money judging other people who struggle with money problems.Must be nice.
Your blatant judgment of my personal situation doesn't surprise me. You couldn't be farther from the truth. We struggle with money problems just like the rest of the world does. And when Cisco laid my husband off in 2001, I was the breadwinner while he took a placeholder job until he got his career back on track a couple months later. Five years ago, we made a choice to keep me at home to raise our kids, because we don't belive it's anyone else's responsibility to raise them in daycare. (Goddamn it, there's that whole 'individual accountability for one's choices' thing again.) So since we are on one income, we've had to make sacrifices and build up savings in case something happened financially. That's basic common sense. Again, it is my responsibility to take care of my own self and my family. Why should that fall on anyone else's shoulders?
Here's the thing. Let's say Ken gets laid off tomorrow. He'd get a six-month severance--we use savings or whatever. I get a job working nights, he gets a job working days--both of which we could walk out and do right now--and we trade off taking care of the babies. (I take my college degrees and go work at Subway. Who gives a fuck? I'm paying my bills and that's my (wait for it!) responsibility.) We make cuts, we figure it out together, because that's how we roll. Does he take unemployment for a couple months? Maybe as a last resort--but he's been paying into that since he was thirteen. It's his fucking money. Would he be on it for three years? Fuck no. That's what people are allowed to do now, and that's just fucking lazy.
WoolyGoat Wrote:I obviously used some hyperbole in my description.
I agree with a lot of what Kennedy stands for, but too much of it is too far out there to be taken seriously. I think he should (and hope he does) pursue some local/state gov't jobs before taking another crack at washington.
Sorry--arguing with idiots makes one forget that hyperbole is used around here. I agree with you. Most Libertarians are way too far out there. (Hello Ron Paul!) S'why I prefaced my self-description at the outset. But I commend him for taking a crack at Washington, because someone needs to do something about that mess.
big day for MA - WoolyGoat - 01-20-2010
Brown up 7 points, ~60% reporting.
big day for MA - Banana - 01-20-2010
littlelolly Wrote:Your blatant judgment of my personal situation doesn't surprise me. You couldn't be farther from the truth. We struggle with money problems just like the rest of the world does. And when Cisco laid my husband off in 2001, I was the breadwinner while he took a placeholder job until he got his career back on track a couple months later. Five years ago, we made a choice to keep me at home to raise our kids, because we don't belive it's anyone else's responsibility to raise them in daycare. (Goddamn it, there's that whole 'individual accountability for one's choices' thing again.) So since we are on one income, we've had to make sacrifices and build up savings in case something happened financially. That's basic common sense. Again, it is my responsibility to take care of my own self and my family. Why should that fall on anyone else's shoulders?'scuse me, but I get a nervous tic when people say things like this. My daughter goes to daycare. My son will too. And they will do so because we feel we give them the best life we can when we are both drawing an income and both pursuing careers we love. Different strokes, to be sure. But, we still consider ourselves accountable for our children. Children don't become your life. They become a part of your life. I value my career and I can do both - be a good parent and pursue a career.
big day for MA - BIRD33 - 01-20-2010
littlelolly Wrote:Your blatant judgment of my personal situation doesn't surprise me. You couldn't be farther from the truth. We struggle with money problems just like the rest of the world does. And when Cisco laid my husband off in 2001, I was the breadwinner while he took a placeholder job until he got his career back on track a couple months later. Five years ago, we made a choice to keep me at home to raise our kids, because we don't belive it's anyone else's responsibility to raise them in daycare. (Goddamn it, there's that whole 'individual accountability for one's choices' thing again.) So since we are on one income, we've had to make sacrifices and build up savings in case something happened financially. That's basic common sense. Again, it is my responsibility to take care of my own self and my family. Why should that fall on anyone else's shoulders?
Here's the thing. Let's say Ken gets laid off tomorrow. He'd get a six-month severance--we use savings or whatever. I get a job working nights, he gets a job working days--both of which we could walk out and do right now--and we trade off taking care of the babies. (I take my college degrees and go work at Subway. Who gives a fuck? I'm paying my bills and that's my (wait for it!) responsibility.) We make cuts, we figure it out together, because that's how we roll. Does he take unemployment for a couple months? Maybe as a last resort--but he's been paying into that since he was thirteen. It's his fucking money. Would he be on it for three years? Fuck no. That's what people are allowed to do now, and that's just fucking lazy.
I don't give a shit about your personal life.I get it.Everybody should be as hard working as you and your Ken.You set the rules on how long people need assistance because you can't see you being that lazy.Why can't those poor people and their children from broken homes walk a mile in your shoes?You are a house wife that probably calls into Glenn Beck to complain.No need to expand further, I think we understand each other.
big day for MA - Banana - 01-20-2010
littlelolly Wrote:Your blatant judgment of my personal situation doesn't surprise me. You couldn't be farther from the truth. We struggle with money problems just like the rest of the world does. .
Government assisted programs are necessary. Are they abused? Yup. overused? Sure. Necessary? Absofuckinglutely. Consider for a second, the family who have say three children. Mom stays at home, dad goes to work at Subway and gets fired because he needs every Wednesday off to go to his AA meeting. Find another job? Not so fast. You have a criminal record? Ok, your job pool just got cut by 80%. Mom can't work. Old back injury. Takes all she has just to care for her children. Should those children starve just because you think "you had 'em, you feed em."?
big day for MA - JCW - 01-20-2010
There definitely need to be safety nets in place but they also need to be more vigilant in weeding out the ones who abuse the system. It goes both ways. I also believe certain steps should be taken by the people on assistance to qualify for it, be it drug testing, job searching, etc. Not just given out as "free money", make the people earn it by doing their part.
big day for MA - littlelolly - 01-20-2010
Banana Wrote:'scuse me, but I get a nervous tic when people say things like this. My daughter goes to daycare. My son will too. And they will do so because we feel we give them the best life we can when we are both drawing an income and both pursuing careers we love. Different strokes, to be sure. But, we still consider ourselves accountable for our children. Children don't become your life. They become a part of your life. I value my career and I can do both - be a good parent and pursue a career.Apologies for the offense. I know plenty of moms who are better moms because they go to work and pursue the careers that they love. Here's the thing. You made the decision, with your husband, to put the littles in daycare. You pay for daycare. I'm pretty sure that you don't get government assistance for said daycare. You took the responsibility to care for your children the best way you see fit, just like we have. You have made decisions accordingly, just like we have. You didn't ask the government to do it for you. In our financial situation, it just made financial sense for me to stay home. It would have cost us more to put them in daycare if I continued to work--and thankfully, I have the type of career that can be put on hold for a few years. Rest assured, however, that as soon as these kids are older and in school all day, my ass goes back to work--both because I want to and we need the income.
Totally different strokes, but we're both doing the same thing--taking responsibility for our children and our choices--and acting accordingly. Because that's our social and personal responsibility.
BIRD33 Wrote:I don't give a shit about your personal life.I get it.Everybody should be as hard working as you and your Ken.You set the rules on how long people need assistance because you can't see you being that lazy.Why can't those poor people and their children from broken homes walk a mile in your shoes?You are a house wife that probably calls into Glenn Beck to complain.No need to expand further, I think we understand each other.You asked me a question about my personal life, so I answered.
So wait...poor people and their children from broken homes are allowed to be lazy for years on end and drain the system? It shouldn't work that way. They're given the assistance to help get them out of their current situation--not to keep them in it. Instead, they've chosen to stay sucking on the government's teat because it's easier--and why should they have to assume any responsibility when they've had a hard life? This is what liberals want them to do. Poor, poor victims. Here. I'll take care of you. Just vote the way I want you to when the elections come 'round, okay?
Banana Wrote:Government assisted programs are necessary. Are they abused? Yup. overused? Sure. Necessary? Absofuckinglutely. Consider for a second, the family who have say three children. Mom stays at home, dad goes to work at Subway and gets fired because he needs every Wednesday off to go to his AA meeting. Find another job? Not so fast. You have a criminal record? Ok, your job pool just got cut by 80%. Mom can't work. Old back injury. Takes all she has just to care for her children. Should those children starve just because you think "you had 'em, you feed em."?'Scuse me, but I get a nervous tic when people say things like this. Mom had an old back injury. Wasn't so bad she couldn't lay on it and put her legs up in the air without contraception in place. Her choice. Dad decided to become an alcoholic? His choice--and the great thing about AA is that they have meetings 24 hours a day, so use another excuse--er, I mean, example. Has a criminal record? He made a choice to break the law. His decisions and lack of responsibility are now the problems of the taxpaying society? He also made the choice to put himself and his children into a situation they couldn't handle. Should those kids starve? No. But should we have to carry the burden of raising his family forever? No. Excuses only work for so long. I think JCW is right when she talks about better safety nets and whatnot. Forward progress needs to be made or we're doing everyone a serious disservice.
big day for MA - Anhil8tor - 01-20-2010
my MIL watches my kids. boy am I glad we don't have to do daycare.
big day for MA - bam - 01-20-2010
My mother-in-law watches my kids too, but we do pay her. When my daughter was in NICU and I got stuck with $100K in medical debt I didn't get any help. I was told I make too much money. When I enrolled in college and went to apply for financial aid, they basically laughed me out the door. Granted, I was able to get loans, but grants? Forget it. My financial aid person actually told me that the only way I'd be able to get assistance is if I had a child out of wedlock and went to a lower paying job. (I only made $10/hour then.) How does that encourage people to do better? I'm not sure. I know that I was infuriated though. I worked full time and went to school full time, all on my own dime. I maintained a 4.0 GPA throughout my college career and I can't get any assistance? What's messed up is when you go to class, work your ass off and then you have some slacker that shows up to class every 3 days just so they can collect their tuition check. So in my opinion is the system abused? Absolutely. Don't get me wrong, if people need help, I'm fine with that, but fuck giving them money and not demanding that they better themselves. What's that saying? Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he'll eat for a lifetime. I personally think it's time we stop "giving" and start "teaching."
big day for MA - Anhil8tor - 01-20-2010
We pay our MIL to watch our kids. It would be absurd not to. I'm very grateful that she has the health and time to be able to do it. It has put my son way ahead of the class.
As far as handouts I don't do them and wouldn't do them. I have made every attempt to put myself in a place where I can be comfortable even if I lose my job. My wife works as well.
big day for MA - bam - 01-20-2010
Anhil8tor Wrote:We pay our MIL to watch our kids. It would be absurd not to. I'm very grateful that she has the health and time to be able to do it. It has put my son way ahead of the class.
As far as handouts I don't do them and wouldn't do them. I have made every attempt to put myself in a place where I can be comfortable even if I lose my job. My wife works as well.
That's exactly what I'm talking about. You are being responsible for yourself and your family and aren't expecting any handouts. Kudos to you!
big day for MA - Anhil8tor - 01-20-2010
Thanks but I'm a republican. Its what we do.
big day for MA - bam - 01-20-2010
Anhil8tor Wrote:Thanks but I'm a republican. Its what we do.
lol I'm a Libertarian, but I won't hold the fact that you're a Republican against you.
big day for MA - Anhil8tor - 01-20-2010
thanks!
big day for MA - bam - 01-20-2010
My folks, my boyfriend, his parents- they're all Republicans and I still like them. My grandparents are Democrats and believe it or not, I still like them. We just don't ever talk about politics.
big day for MA - Banana - 01-20-2010
Anhil8tor Wrote:my MIL watches my kids. boy am I glad we don't have to do daycare.
My MIL works at the daycare. Best of both worlds
